Well OK then, I stand by all I said in the first reply. Though I may have exaggerated a bit in suggesting White Oak seasons at a geologic pace, it's something more akin to glacial...

Doesn't mean there will not be radial shrinkage and checking, there will be, and it will continue well into the coming decade.

You can try to control it now, by understanding it and its behavior as it checks. Your chance is now.

Are there not flats to mill on the sides that face out?

Postponing is not controlling.

Best with it -

Well Will, we are doing straw bale so I don't need a flat face for cladding etc... I'm lost. Am I postponing or am I slowing? What is the goal again? Doesn't slowing help? or if the checking is inevitable in the long run, then why bother? Doesn't throwing the logs in a pond (as suggested) just postpone? I'm not concerned with appearances. I don't mind a very rustic look so long as the oak posts are structurally sound.

What I am hearing is that to control checking, I need to do some type of cutting on the wood, flattening one side, or making a kerf or boring up the middle and anything else I am doing to slow the drying is just delaying the inevitable. OK, that makes sense if true.

I guess I could hire a sawyer to come up and flatten one side if it will keep my posts structurally sound.

thanks

Since you are not milling your logs, you will not be getting rid of the rot prone sap wood. Uncover your logs and debark them, let air circulate and keep them from molding or rotting (you do not want to bring molded wood into your home). Slowing the release of moisture will only minimize the checking. End sealer is a better way of slowing the release of moisture. Kerfing the side of your log that doesn't show will minimize checking even more. If the checks don't bother you aesthetically then don't worry, most checking isn't a major structural issue. It can get bad near the end of the logs and cause problems with joints, which is one plus for end sealer. If all of your logs are long, apply the sealer after you cut them to length.

If you do decide to flatten one side then a kerf on that same side would be easy enough.

The clean and easy version: peel and stack your logs off the ground and in a manner in which air can circulate. Apply an end sealer after you have cut them to length.

I'm going to try to insert some pix. We were going to de-bark the logs right away, but when I saw this difference in checking, I had second thoughts. Plus the bark is VERY DIFFICULT to remove right now and I KNOW it will be easier later. Sprayed all the logs with BORATE. With that plus them being up off the ground with air circ, they should not rot or get bugs. Yes, if we do bark now, put moisture sealer on the whole log, not just the ends. So here's pix of checking with bark, checking w/o bark, and the log pile as a whole. My concern lately has been the building inspector looking at my posts with big cracks half way through them and, uh, having a "negative reaction"...Thanks!
[img]http://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B_oPh1AA...wMGUw&hl=en[/img] [img]http://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B_oPh1AA...hMjBm&hl=en[/img] [img]http://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B_oPh1AA...zMDNm&hl=en[/img]

Paul - Has some red flag been raised with the code enforcement inspector? I should think that enough full round work happens in your neck that he's seen checking, and understands that checks do not effect "structural soundness".

All I'm suggesting is that you cannot prevent the inevitable, you can however predict and even encourage the probable by understanding the material you are working with.

Yes it should both be worth the cost of bringing in a portable bandmill, and choosing interior sides now, clip the side closest to the pith, this side should naturally check heaviest given even drying, clipped even closer to the heart, it will. Once radial tension is relieved by this check the rest of the stems circuference will check less (read that less, there will be other checks, the hope is to have the unseen one be the only large enough to stuff your fingers in) than it would otherwise.

You want as much of this radial release to happen before you begin your bale enclosure (preventing air flow to this side) as is possible.

Sealing the whole log is to be avoided, and nothing you want to clean up later.

You don't seem to be understanding what we are trying to convey. You do not want to try to seal the whole log. That will impede the drying of the log. We want the log to dry evenly. This is what will reduce checking. The ends of the logs are very porous, and much like cutting an artery, will bleed moisture out faster from the ends, causing the ends to dry quickly and the middle to still have lots of moisture. You seal the ends so that moisture can escape only out of the outside skin of the log. You remove the bark so that outside skin can breathe and release the moisture. Moisture escaping out the skin will happen slowly and with the ends sealed, the log will release the moisture much more evenly, thus preventing many of the large internal stresses that are caused by uneven drying. You've got to understand that when the water leaves, the fibers shrink, so if it shrinks in one place faster than another, it creates internal stress, and a check opens up relieving that stress- the fibers basically rip apart in that area.
The other methods described are other ways to try and control checking. If you were using timbers, sawing your logs to your timber size would help control checking, because usually the smaller the piece, the smaller the checking and the easier to control it. Think about it, in a smaller stick, the water has a shorter distance to travel out and will dry quicker than a larger piece. As long as you control how evenly with end grain sealing and shade, smaller pieces will check smaller. But since you are going to build round, this does not apply to you.
The kerfing mentioned basically tries to control checking by creating an artificial check or stress relief. Instead of fighting itself as the log shrinks radially, it can shrink away from the kerf, and the kerf will open up like a check as the log shrinks.
Isn't there someplace you can put your logs in the shade?

My logs were much easier to debark using the drawknife when they were green. Much harder after the bark and top surface had dried some.

Thanks for your comments everybody. I think a lot of my confusion is coming from lack of understanding of the actual physics involved so I appreciate the explanations. Yes, the inspectors are wary of my ungraded poles and will be examining them closely. They are willing to let me use them if they pass a visible inspection and are sized as grade #2. I'm sure they will expect checking but I just don't want to be able to, you know, stick a crow bar all the way through the log...

I've done a lot of debarking in the past. This white oak behaves differently than some other species (fir and pine). It acts more like birch and maple which peel easily after they dry for a while. I have noticed that if you let it age a bit, the bark will fall right off after the wood shrinks. I've had logs de-bark themselves, just from dumping off the truck. On the green Oak, the bark is SUPER tight and very reluctant to come off no matter which tool and how sharp...It comes off in little chips instead of nice big strips. It took us about 3 hours to debark one 10 foot log after which the log checked drastically and we both had sore elbows! Leaving the bark on for a few months and end sealing should result in relatively even drying (I hope) and easier de-barking. I thought about buying a log wizard but just heard too many poor reviews.

I will definitely consider milling 1 side. I know a good sawyer with experience with White Oak.

Thanks again and sorry if this thread has been redundant.