Hello All!

I have a ton of questions! Take your best shot at all or one of them...

I have been lurking and posting a few times, here and really enjoy the site. I'm taking the TF class at Heartwood in three weeks, I can't wait! (Anyone else taking the same class?) I have been volunteering my time with a few timber framers in CT and have been to three raising's. I 'm undecided as to how to start my plans for a timber frame cabin. After taking the class I want to cut a frame this summer, but I can't start on the cabin for a few years until finances allow. So, what should I do in the mean time. I don't need any TF's on my property now, (I already have an 1870 20 x 30 TF barn).

I have been having trouble finding plans for TF's. Does anyone know of a source? I have Jack Sobon's book with the 12 x 16 shed, and have considered starting with that. How long could I let it sit stacked in my barn or outsde covered and not have to worry about wood shrinkage (White Pine)? Do you think I could sell the frame at cost so it is not sitting around?

Does anyone need help as an "apprentice" in the CT area where I would work for free with some free instruction on Timber Framing. What would I expect to pay for a set of plans for my Cabin (appox 24 x 24, two story) if I had a timber frame architect or timber framer design it with a complete cut list and detailed drawings of the joinery?

Thanks for any and all advice!

Bob

Take a look at the TFG's recent publication, http://tfguild.stores.yahoo.net/tifrguplbo.html

As mentioned is a good start.


White pine drys quickly through the ends of the timbers. So, once you've cut the joints on the ends, I'd suggest coating them with an end sealer, which is a wax based paint. Don't use regular paint it won't do anything for you. Get some end sealer known as "Anchorseal" and it will do the job nicely.
It is produced by UCCoatings. I'm sure you can find the site with a simple Internet search.
After a joint is completed paint the sealer on the end grain surfaces. This will force the timber to dry through the side surfaces which will make it dry slower, thus reducing end checking.
Stacking your timbers inside will help them to dry slowly and this will also help prevent twisting and cracking.
Normally the wood would only dry maybe an inch a year in an unheated environment so it could take years to dry to the core.

Again proper stacking with supports every four feet under the timbers in each layer, or even two feet, will help keep your timbers straight before and after joinery. Also, after the last top layer is placed on the pile, put on another layer of something else to hold the top layer down so that it doesn't twist or bow on you. Also, keep each layer's blocking aligned over the support blocks on the ground. This is important to prevent uneven loads from bending timbers over time.

At my sawmill yard I construct timber and lumber drying frame bases like this:



And then each layer of timbers has it's blocking over the supports on the base layer.



Possibly.....it depends on how to market it and the needs of your area...



That depends on the level of information you'll need on the plans. Some designers only do bent drawings and details. Some do individual stick drawings of each type of piece needed in the frame. The more drawings you need the more it will cost you...

I'd be happy to give you a quote on the drawings...

Jim Rogers

Sounds quite ambitious. My thought is, if you are going to do all the work of building a frame, better have the purpose for it. Does a family member need a house addition? If they pay the materials, you build the frame for them. Better that relatives get your free labor(or lower cost labor) than strangers, eh?
I wouldn't want to build a frame that is not intended for a specific purpose.
The frame should be your design. At least it should be your overall dimensions, and if need be, specifically designed by someone else. With a plan in hand, it's down hill from there. What you could do, is order oak brace stock, let it dry, and then cut braces for the frame. If the brace stock is sufficiently dry, it will be stable. You can then see how you like working the dry wood compared to green wood. If it suits you, you can order the other material and let it season some before cutting, increasing the stability of the pieces.
I agree that to dry the wood, you want to properly stack it, seal the endgrain as quickly as possible to prevent quick drying from the ends, and encourage slower more even drying from the sides, and keep the stock out of the sun. The sun will dry timbers more quickly and likely unevenly.
Some may say that cutting the wood dry is more difficult than wet. How much more difficult is my question. I've cut some dry white oak that didn't seem bad to me, though not a whole frame. Sharp tools are important.
By doing a dedicated design(without a firm timeline) and starting with braces etc, you get to test the waters without having to buy all the wood or build the whole frame at once.
Best of luck and let us know how your class went.

Jim -

So your opinion is that I could order, cut the joinery, and then stack as you propose in your drawings, sealed on the ends and then let it sit a few years in an unheated barn? I just don't want it to "move" so much that I can't put it together when I'm ready. Are the smaller timbers in your drawings rough cut 4 x 4's, or could they be smaller?

Thanks!

Bob

Bob:
The order in which you do things depends on your needs.
If you want to learn to cut joints then you can start at any place in the frame that you want.
We usually start at the bottom and work our way up. We cut the joints in the sills, and floor joists, then posts and tie beams.
After that plates and rafters.
Braces, nailers, connecting girts, wall nailers, collar beams, braces can be mixed in just about any where along the process.

If you order your stock and it gets delivered then you'll need to stack it properly, right after it's delivered. You can sort it as you stack it so that you get the pieces you need as you progress along.

Restacking in another pile as the finished pieces are done.

After you have cut all your joints, what we usually do is a full frame fit up. To do that we first test each joint into it's mate, one tenon to one mortise to make sure it fits. And trim what is necessary to make it go together correctly.
Once all joints in one assembly have been tried, one on one, then the entire assemble is put together:



Above you can see we are test fitting a wall assembly together.

If you're going to cut the joints and erect the frame some years later, I would wait and about a couple of weeks before you're planning to raise the frame do your test fit up. At that time bore all your holes. I've seen holes distort over time while drying out without a peg in them.
The fit up procedure on the Jack Sobon garden shed would be to fit the sills and cross sills. Then assemble them so that you'll have a deck to work on. Placing your floor boards on top of your floor joists leaving a cut out for each post. Then test fit your long walls together using a post from each bent.
After the two long walls are done, assemble each bent, but this time don't take them apart. Assemble the last bent to be raised first and then next and finish with the first bent to be raised last.
You can leave them stacked with the foot of each post near it's pocket in the sill. So that they can easily be tipped up on raising day.

After you have raised and braced off your bents you place on top of your posts the plates and then the rafters.....

I'm sure you've seen this done as you have been to some raisings.

You asked: "Are the smaller timbers in your drawings rough cut 4 x 4's, or could they be smaller?"
and: Each frame is designed for the function it is intended to serve. Some standard sizes can be used when the function isn't truly known.
Simple wall nailers for vertical siding can be 4x4 or maybe smaller, it depends.....

Jim Rogers

Brad -

As a matter of fact, my wife's cousin wants me to build her a 2 car garage/studio. Second floor would be finished for computer classes. But I don't think she is ready for me to work on it yet. I wouldn't know the first thing about adding an addition to some ones house, thats out of the question!

I thought I could use the 12 x 16 as a small starter cabin and then use it as an addition or shed. Even a bunk house for children when the main cabin is finished. I have some land in VT already, but I really want to sell it and buy a lake front lot for the cabin. But as I said, finances prevent me from starting now (my son is in college).

How long should I let the oak brace stock dry before cutting it? I want to start cutting something as soon as my class is finished. I can't wait for wood to dry!! I have had enough trouble waiting until the class... My wife thinks I am crazy, getting timber quotes for a shed that we don't need, or cabin a we don't have the land to build on yet.

Thanks!

Bob

Joel -

Do the plans in the book have details of the joinery? I will need a lot of detail as I'm a novice at this.

Bob

Nope.

Jim -

Thanks for the detailed answer. The 4 x 4's I asked about were in your drawing of how to stack the timbers. I wanted to know what you use as "stickers" to keep the timbers separated.

Bob