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A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System #22433 01/29/10 05:52 PM
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Meddins Offline OP
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In trying at all costs to avoid an outboard frame enclosing my timber frame, I've been thinking about the following system (which I'm sure is nothing new but a search didn't bring up any posts specifically addressing this idea).

From outside to inside:

* board and batten siding
* 1x horizontal nailers
* sheathing directly on timber frame and studs (some timber studs and and some 2x studs)
* wall cavities between timbers and studs receive blown in or damp spray cellulose (to 6" or so)
* lath
* lime plaster flush with interior face of timber frame

I can see some issues perhaps arising with timber shrinkage affecting the interface between timber and exterior sheathing, as well as interface between timber and lime plaster. Any other issues that should be obvious to me but aren't at the moment that should really concern me? Thanks,

Miles


Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: Meddins] #22436 01/29/10 06:22 PM
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TIMBEAL Offline
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Construct a hybrid. Meet them in the middle. Build the stud wall flush with the exterior of the frame, board it over and apply a thermal layer over the boards, 2" of foam, which you strap and side giving an air space for the boarding to dry. This will give the thermal brake and tighten the envelope some, even after the frame and other material has shrunk. You have to give some to take some.

Tim

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: TIMBEAL] #22438 01/29/10 09:18 PM
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Thanks for the input Tim. I should have mentioned one reason I'm trying to keep the wall system in one plane is so that everything can sit atop a 10" poured concrete wall. Another reason is just to cut down on material, although the wall system you describe doesn't add too much more to the mix. And yet another reason is that I like the look of timber and plaster walls much more than the look of the timber frame standing alone inside the building space.

I realize that the timber/plaster interface requires repointing with plaster as timbers move and shrink.

I can see how the wall system I described in the first post might not make for the tightest house in terms of air infiltration. The thing is, here in the hot humid South my main concern is keeping the house cool, rather than trying to keep out our comparatively mild 8 week winters :-). As such, putting time and energy into a "cool roof" system seems more important than building a super tight envelope. At least that's how I'm thinking about the building design at this stage.

Miles

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: Meddins] #22439 01/29/10 11:59 PM
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The climate in which you live can have an impact on how the wall system is constructed, for sure. Perhaps it is not such an issue, but in colder climates it is.

knowing your location, in the southern part of the country would influence my opinion. On the surface I see no problems with the system you have outlined. Perhaps someone from the south will add to it.

What type of plaster are you planning on using?

Tim

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: TIMBEAL] #22451 01/30/10 06:02 PM
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For plaster I was planning on slaking some lime and making plaster according to the recipes in "Building With Lime". There are several limestone quarries and lime manufacturing plants within 45 minutes drive. They sell 1 ton super sacks of quicklime for around $200 (I think).

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: Meddins] #22467 01/31/10 07:54 PM
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Howdy,

Miles, I would love to see pictures of the process and hear your feedback. Methinks a lot of other people around here would as well.

As far as the heat in the South..

Well, I was broken by my mother who would not turn on the AC until the mercury hit 95 F. We got pretty good at creating wind tunnels with certain doors and windows open.

And then a nice deciduous tree to the southern exposure would help as well.

Keep us posted please.

p.s. you too Tim!

Last edited by mo; 01/31/10 07:59 PM.
Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: mo] #22470 01/31/10 10:19 PM
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I am working on it. We now have a flip video camera. Photos are old school. I just have to become familiar with the new school, the kids are helping.

I had some lime shipped to me from Virginia Lime Works, shipping cost more than the lime. I need to perfect my clam shell method.

Tim

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: TIMBEAL] #22488 02/02/10 02:56 AM
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Gabel Offline
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I really like the sound of that wall, and I like the look of the timbers with the plaster coming up to it as the inside finish.

I'd like to come up with a way to keep the air infiltration down, personally. I live in a drafty old farmhouse now, and when I build a new one, I'd like it to be a little tighter (and so would my wife). I suppose the biggest problem areas would be at the timber/plaster interface.

I'm also thinking about having 18" or so tall dwarf walls and a timber sill on top of that. And hopefully an earth floor with radiant heat in it.

You could hold the plaster back 3/4" or so from the face of the timbers to add some visual interest. You could have the baseboard die into the corner posts... You could hold the braces to the inside face if you wanted to see them... nice curvy braces...hmmmmm.

I have to think about this some more. How hard is it to learn how to plaster?

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: Gabel] #22495 02/02/10 08:49 AM
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Hi Gabel,

I recall an article in Joiners Quarterly about 10+ years ago that illustrated this technique being used at Fox Maple, Browneville, Maine and so maybe Steve Chappell could provide us with a an update on the short to medium term performance of adopting this approach.

Anybody know Steve ?

Regards

Ken Hume

Ken Hume


Looking back to see the way ahead !
Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: Ken Hume] #22496 02/02/10 12:27 PM
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I attended a workshop at Fox Maple, Brad bb did also. I worked on one of the frames he has in his compound, the dormitory. One of the aspects he implemented was to rout a channel on the timbers side facing the infill, this acted as a key for the infill and to assist in stopping air flow after drying occurred. At least that was the plan when I was there. From my little knowledge of Steve C. I suspect that plan could change or may not have.

The key would also direct the checking of the timber to an unseen face.

Tim

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: TIMBEAL] #22503 02/02/10 04:36 PM
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daiku Offline
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If you plaster flush to the inside of the timbers, won't your corner posts completely disappear? And the braces and girts will be buried in the wall?


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Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: TIMBEAL] #22506 02/02/10 04:55 PM
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I like that wall as well, and will be building a variation of it this spring. I would also add foam over the sheathing for a number of reasons.

When I've done walls with infill framing, I've used two methods to deal with the plaster/timber interface. You can just plaster or flat tape to the timber or you can use zip strip for a reveal. If you're using old timbers, or if you're working on your own house and you wait 5 years to finish it (who me?) there's very little timber shrinkage and movement.

The other option is what we call zip strip, I think it's actually called trim tex tear-away bead. It's usually spray adhesived over the sheetrock, and then skimmed over with plaster or mud. It makes a very clean even reveal. It probably could stick to a basecoat of lime plaster, and then be skimmed over. Or maybe could make your own version with a beveled wooden ground?

I will be putting 3 coat lime plaster on the walls of my house in a few weeks. I'll let you know how it goes.

Gabel, sounds like you need to build.

Re: A Proposed Simple Timber Frame Wall System [Re: daiku] #22516 02/03/10 01:42 AM
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Oh yeah, hadn't thought about corner posts...if you held the plaster back 3/4" from the face of the frame you'd have a funny little triangular column of wood in each corner. Maybe run a lamb's tongue chamfer on the edge of each corner post for a point of interest?

For braces I like Gabel's idea of orienting them to the inside face of the frame. Any reasons - structurally speaking - why this would be less ideal than centering braces or holding them to the exterior face as usual?

Miles

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