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Re: Big Al [Re: TIMBEAL] #33735 06/12/16 06:38 PM
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Roger Nair Offline
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No pictures at the ready. I have another reason why I'm not using carpenter pencils, I've hung it all up, so I may not have an example in my shed. Use them, loose them, they were all made from scrap. Better versions can be made ie have the beam edges bound with steel creating a square with an edge that will stand against wear from an awl and offset the points to the dimension of storypole. Anyhow good luck with it.

Here is some info on my approach.

http://forums.tfguild.net/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=1960&Number=8402#Post8402

Re: Big Al [Re: Roger Nair] #33736 06/12/16 10:55 PM
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Jay White Cloud Offline
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Originally Posted By: TIMBEAL
With such a system, it would matter not the metric or standard system of measurements. Could be that a ratio of say 4:1 2" mortice/tenon on an 8" timber.


Excellent point!!

I love metric when doing my design work as the "unit ten" and decimal nature of it just works really well...for more reasons than worth listing...

The point (when it comes to the tangible elements of design and timber framing) is really what should be stressed...I make a point with student (et al) to the "history" of "good design" is typically (or should be) based on balanced proportions (aka the "golden section.)

So..."it does not matter"...(actually) the modality one chooses to "measure by" as the true importance is the proportional balance one is trying to achieve, be it based on elements of the "golden section" or related numerical sequence orientation (Fibonacci as just one example.)

"Pinned" (or trammeled) story poles are wonderful methods of "story poling" as the "pins" create (with just slight pressure) a mark to begin consistent (and easily) laid out joinery...

Re: Big Al [Re: TIMBEAL] #33745 06/16/16 03:47 PM
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Hylandwoodcraft Offline
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All my layout is snap-line center rule and I use my Big Al all the time for it. I keep the fence on mine though, because for members such as floor joists and rafters I just pick the top reference face, and go off of that.
I've not tried using story poles, but I find that my lay
flat tape measures are invaluable along with the ink line and Big Al. That combination seems to be very fast and accurate for me.
I keep on dabbling with knifing my lines but I haven't gone over to it yet. Perhaps it's because I do the joinery while it is rough cut that I haven't been convinced of it's worth. It's seems hard to strike a really accurate visible line. In planed or even hewn timbers it seems like it would work great. Even if I am doing a planed frame, I do the joinery in the rough and plane it with my Makita planers right before it goes to the site. All my joinery is housed and I have the ink lines to reference to, so I can dial the timbers in pretty well with the planer.

Re: Big Al [Re: TIMBEAL] #33746 06/16/16 04:52 PM
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Jay White Cloud Offline
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Hey Sean!!

Good to know it works with line rule...That awesome!!

One of guys in our group does machining and has made a few precision piece for going around edges and the like...He plans on making a few similar items now in metric...

I think the difference between a wood story pole and a flat tape isn't that great at all...Each has its vertus...things under 5 metres we often use wood...item that are longer get the tape and there is some mixing between the two.

We hardly do any "knifing" either and we too employ ink for layout...Doing mainly Asian and related "Folk Styles" and their systems of layout...everything is in traditional inking systems of marking...Many timbers laid out look pretty much like you would find in China, Korea, or Japan in overall line and inking layout patterns...

Re: Big Al [Re: TIMBEAL] #33747 06/16/16 07:56 PM
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Hylandwoodcraft Offline
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Jay, I snap my lines in ink, but just use a sharp hard leaded carpenter's pencil for joinery layout. That seems to work well for me. Out of curiosity, what advantage do you find laying out in all ink?

Re: Big Al [Re: TIMBEAL] #33748 06/17/16 06:24 AM
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Jay White Cloud Offline
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Hmmm....advantage???...more a "style" and "modality" than anything...If your system works...KEEP IT!!!

I "template" all my joinery...so technically only lay a joint once in full scale "joint maps" that I used to draft out now I print them out directly from my blueprint "layout" CAD modeling...So these have "targets" (points from the story pole) on them and these get placed on the "line layout." This is actually a very ancient system, just with modern tools, inks, and related materials...I like the ink because it is a traditional system of layout...I seldom need to plan it off do to error in layout because of the "story poles" I use...Ink shows up much better...is more durable. I use pencil too...but it is a soft dark lead .7mm and/or .5mm for some applications...

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