My question is how did you guys that do these timber frame jobs break into it? I'm almost fifty and been doing contracting for almost 30 years and interested in timberframing almost that long , but can't seem to make the transition to doing just log and timber joinery. I'm pretty good at it , I have great referenses, and have a reputation for doing whatever I set my mind to. The thing that always seems to kill the deal is my honesty. They ask " ever build a timber frame house before " I answer " no " , end of story. I could show them projects that would blow them away but the confidense factors already blown. Any suggestions would be apreciated. Thanks in advance.Timbo out

Maybe you could blow them away before they ask if you have built a house? Kind of a first impressions thing.

Dave

How about getting in on some of the Guilds projects, and/or finding a local timber framer that might need some help with cutting or raising a frame? At the least you will have gained some more info on timber framing, and at best you can tell potential clients that you have had some experience with it. Or build yourself a couple small out buildings so you can show people what you are capable of.....I think you have the drive to do it, now you just need to manifest it. Keep going!

Timbo,

I am sort of in the same boat there with you. Not so much just TF but larger construction in general.
There seems to be a huge misconception out there about what it takes to build anything with a certain size. I get calls about additions or building a house somewhat frequently. I talk to the customers, show them my portfolio......
Everthing seems to be going fine until they ask when I could start and how many guys I would have on the job. That is usually the end of it. Then when I look around I can see why they are thinking that 2 guys cannot build a house but 4-6 can. They are used to seeing that many guys on the job. Now wether or not they all are actually working does not seem to matter. There are 4-6 guys so that is what it takes. I have seen to many jobs though with a large crew on it. And most of the time they are just standing around talking and if you were lucky enough you might see one or two of them working. Slow pace though. Yeah, they are right it takes 4-6 because that way they can be assured that somebody will be working some. But they are paying all of them for just being there. So you need to come up with some other way to proof that you can pull it off. I have great references but even they do not really help when it comes down to it. At the most they get your foot in the door.

If you are interested I am trying to aquire a piece of land and want to build a German Timberframe spec house on it. This way I hope I can get some customers interested. Plus they can see that I can build a house with just two guys and not a bunch of......, well lets not get into that. But I am still in the planning phase of it.

Timbo, work the small stuff first, tf porch on a conventional house, tf great room in a conventional house, tf bunkie for a cottage, tf to make that wall dissapear.... Just keep workin it, it will happen and it's worth it when it does.

Thanks for the great advice. Most of these projects I have done up to moving and re-erecting a 36 x60 timber barn on a raised foundation. A very high profile job which led to the only new frame I've built. But then the work switched to repair work ( 7 years ago ) and we've never got back to new construction. I usually don't advertise with the exception of trying to sell barn frames thru a local swap rag. This does seem to get me leads tho rather cold leads. I think the advice of something big that I can always show is a good idea, such as the hybred timber addition I'm building on my house. A friend once called advertising as shameless self promotion , I guees I need to learn to blow my own horn. Thanks, Timbo out

Timbo where are you from?

I would be happy to send you some leads.

I'm in northern NY about 60 miles north of Syracuse. Thanks

If I get anything from there I'll send you an email

timbo,
my situation was, and is, similar. I’ve focused on building barns, the bigger the better. I’ve played with different timber framing styles and techniques while building many barns over the last 7 years. My TF business is an aggressive PT venture and I don’t think I would be able to evolve in the same fashion if it were a FT venture. We build about 10 large/medium barns a year and have built a few homes/additions and specialty structures along the way. I’ve found, and many others have found, that cutting and erecting a TF house or addition is not the world’s biggest challenge, but finishing that frame can be!! Many TFer only do TFing, they do not finish homes. If you’re going to focus on the general contractor end of the business, it really is a different business. I’m not sure what direction to move in, but I’m leaning toward just offering TF’s and not GC services.

All of the buildings we have built are available to support growth of the business should I actually find the energy and brains to do that!! My biggest issues remaining the business end of the world. The building is challenging but the business end gives me a head ach!!

I guess my suggestion is to take it slow, the business will come and keep it fun!!

Best of luck
pete

I kind of like the notion of just doing frames and maybe drying in. The mason always gets paid , but the GC sometimes is left holding the bag(empty)at the end hoping to realize his profit. I know most phases of house building , but I must admit the challenges of the GC are not to appealing. If your not the GC then your a sub I gues.

We GC almost everything we build.

I'm amazed at what some people can get paid for. Some of the projects that have come across my desk or we have been called to "fix" just leave me shaking my head. The best one was a $9000.00 set of drawings for a "timberframe" (I'm using that term loosely since most of us wouldn't have called it that)and it couldn't be built. The house had a 3.5/12 valley that ran for 37 ft on the South east side of the house. I asked the homeowner if he had a snow shovel to get the snow off the roof in the winter

The architect told the customer to "follow the blueprints".

Architects can get between 6 - 10 % of the total project even though many of them don't have a clue how to build a timber frame house. And I'm not just talking about joinery, I'm talking about HOW TO BUILD A TIMBER FRAME HOUSE.

The part thats hardest for me to swallow is we do the same thing everyday on every project we have built. The concept drawings, blueprints, mechanical and electrical drawings, footing, foundations and we actually have built a timber frame before. Yet when we ask for just a small charge for our drawings people think we should "throw" it in with the project.

Then at the end of the job after everybody else gets paid in full we have to "negotiate" a final price. Usually for thousands less than what we have in it. Plus according to state law as a GC we have to warranty it for 25 years.

I'm really thinking we just want to cut frames LOL.

Not sure what it is about the construction industry and getting paid for the services that are being supplied. If you take your car into the shop to get it fixed or if you see a doctor and they hand you the bill, there is no argueing about it. You pay or else you will not get your car or they hire a collector.
But with building the customer, even when they have agreed to the terms in the contract they still decide that they need to knock some money off. And the worst we go along with it. What a sad world.

Timbo,
Speaking from my experience I have been in the building industry for over 15 years.Ten owning my own company.
We started stick building garages .
Then we did homes and garages.
Next we concentrated on Shell Homes all dryed in with all interior partitions framed.
We began building Barns in 1999/ 2000 stick framing a few with Rough Hemlock and then doing the "POST and BEAM" thing using lag bolts and thoughtfully placed nails. This led us to Timber Framing. After years of reading about it and cutting practice joints we were as ready as we could be. I got my first job and never wanted to do "regular construction" again.
I didn't say that I never did.Only that I never wanted to. Some times you have to put macaroini on the table.It is hard to break out of the mold.
We changed the name of our buisiness we go to fairs and display frames near our shop. And still some people will say oh yeah I know what you do -- you build pre-fab homes. Many however are very familiar and they long for a quality of home or barn that only a timberframe can provide. It is easy to recognize these people. If you really want to timberframe start with a small out building and go from there. Take the time to volunteer in a local shop or go to a Guild sponsored raising.

Have fun building,

David

Good advice all. In the past my wife and I have kicked around of the ideas David just mentioned , but never got around to doing any of them in any significant way. I wish I had a dollar for every sheet of drawings and plans I've done! If I started today I couldn't build every thing I've drawn before I die. In the past whenever we did a high profile jobs we'd get tantalizing leads , but then before we knew it we where doing roofs again. Guees what kind of leads that generated. I had a week off once(unpaid vacation) and I built a sweet little dovetail cabin and the attention that little building got me was amasing. We sold another little cabin as a result but then I got sucked back into the rat-race.I think if I had a year and about 60,000 k I could make a go of it.

I know what you mean E.H.

The customer shops around, until they are certain they have the best price to start with. Then they try to negotiate a better one.

Make changes all through the project add things that they admit at the time was not in the bid. But still expect it to be done for nothing and sometimes get it.

And STILL at the end of the job they don't want to pay the bill.

Its wierd. But what do you do. You can sue everyone of them if you want to... But what does that do for your reputation.

You try to build the absolutely best house you can build and your reputation along with it knowing you are doing lots of extras, that absolutely weren't in the bid.

And all I want is a happy customer at the end of the job who pays thier bill. The one they agreed to in first place. We don't hide anything. Everything is in the contract and revised in the change orders. And STILL at the end of the job its always a same dance different partners to get paid.

The saddest part is I can't afford a timber frame home LOL.

We have come to the conclusion if the customer isn't going to be happy no matter what we do. We are going home with thier money. No sense having them be complaining and doing it with my money in thier pocket at the same time.