Due to numerous queries as to where to find the Makita 13" saw I decided to do some investigation into what has apparently become the timberframe tool unicorn. I was told it has not been offered (legitimately) since 84. It is however, still made

Working my way up the food chain at Makita I was able to speak with the gentleman in charge of that product line who said he would not be opposed to campaigning to bring it back if he could find a market for it.
And so this post....
If this is something you are interested in please post a reply and explain why you would like to see this saw available. If you have or have owned one of these saws please post what you like about it.

Our man at Makita will be checking in

Next...the hollow chisel mortiser!!!

Hi John,

is this saw similar to the, I believe, 12" saw still being sold? If so why do you like it?

Having used different brand models the Makita did not quite cut it for me. The base is to small and flimsy. The saw is not very well balanced and it did not feel right holding it. Does not run very smooth either. Height and angle adjustments are awkward.
So the only plus is the price. Sorry I am not being very helpful here. But maybe the saw you are looking for is indeed better then the one presently on the market.

I own a 13 inch Makita saw.

I like the size, but the Makita saws that are sold in the UK are far better and I believe would be popular among North American Timber Framers.

Specifically the 5103R which cuts a 4x4 and the 5143R which cuts over 5 inches.

I would much rather see those offered here rather than the lesser quality 10 inch and 16 inch saws they offer now.

The 16 inch is a good saw, but the baseplate leaves much to be desired.

-Collin

When I was looking into buying a saw a some time ago my favorite was and still is the MAfell. But I was not willing to spend that much money. So the other choices where Makita and a worm drive Bosch with BIGFOOT attachment. I opted for the slightly pricier Bosch (15amp and $50 more than the Makita) because it does have a heavier and wider base than the Makita cuts a full 6x6 and has a 75 degree tilting range. Handling and balance is good. Only thing I do not like about it are the cam locks. I always brake my fingers on those to get them loose. But it is a good compromise for the money.

I would buy a Makita 13" tomorrow if I could find one. I beleive that it is the best saw for drop cutting tenons. I use the 10 1/4" saw for 90 % of the time, it would be nice to have a little deeper cut. I would also be interested in the Makita saws that are sold in the UK.
I find that the narow base is less affected by rough or irregular surfaces than a wide/ less flexable base. Tom

John, work on getting back the MAKITA , 1001N - CURVED RABBETING PLANER. I would buy one of those also. Tom

Yes, there is no doubt that the 13 inch saw would sell well to timber framers.

The chisel mortiser and housing router would also do quite well.
-Collin

Tom,

I have yet to come across a saw with a base that minds rough surfaces. Any saw I have ever worked with was sliding just fine no matter what size base it had. The blades are making the difference.
As for the irregular surfaces. The beam would have to be extremly uneven ( curved, stepped up or down) for the small base to be of advantage.
I find the wider the base the more stable the saw therefore the more accurate the cut. With a small base one is more likely to tilt the saw slightly during the cut thus ending up with an out of square cut. Just my opinion.

I don't own one.
I'd buy two today and then kick myself 6 months from now when they were no longer available and wish I'd bought 6.
The reasons for the popularity of this saw are its size and its motor.
The size is probably the perfect size of larger saw, just large enough for 5" depth of cut, but much lighter and much easier to handle than the 16" Mak.
The motor is 15 amps, and it is strong. It is the only saw from Makita's late 1970-1980s product line to come with the 15 amp motor. Even my 16" has a 12 amp (I need to get a new one of those, too).
Amongst the framers I know, this saw has replaced the Super Square on the most sought after piece of kit...
The only direct competition is the Big Boy, which is nowhere near as good of a saw, and the mafell 14", which is pricey, but a very nice saw, although it didn't seem to me to be as maneuverable as the 13" makita. Oh yeah, and the Protool 13", which is similar to the mafell in price/maneuverability.
It will be interesting to see how this develops.
Cheers,
Whit

@ Whit Holder,

if I am trying to do overhead cuts and other not so save maneuvers than the weight and size of the Makita is certainly a good feature for a saw that size.
For the most part the beams are cut on horses at a comfortable height. So the "heavy weight" MAfell or Holzher( only offered in Germany) are not that awkward to handle especially since they are very well balanced. Not so the Makita partially because it so/ too slim. A circular saw is mostly used to make straight cuts wether they are at a 90 degree angle or any other angle within the tilting range of a saw. For tenons I would use a handheld bandsaw or a smaller circular anyway.
Then there is the fact that the Makitas might be less expensive but seem not to like heavy use. We have burned up a lot of them where I used to worked in Germany. Just where not made for the task. The Holzher on the other hand(similar to the Mafell) would not give up. My experience with Makita tools is that they don't feel right in your hands, do not run smooth, have a lot of torque but unfortunately do not last very long. You get what you pay for.
Which should not stop anyone from buying them since apparently they seem to be very popular. My impression, reading the posts here and in other Forums, is that besides the fact that there are not a lot of tools to choose from in this category the Makita seems to be the best bang for the buck but if Mafell for example had tools in the same price range everybody would be buying Mafell.

I would buy one and one of the carpenters who works with me would as well.

The 13" Makita is a great tool. I have used them and find them to be pretty much the perfect size for North American style timber framing. I have used the Bigboy, Protool, and various mafells. I like the Makita.

I would certainly be interested in the newer style saws sold in the UK that Colin mentioned, as I have used them on several occasions over there. I like the soft start, the weight, and the lower guard mechanism.

Either model (old or new) would be popular with American timber framers.

Gabel

E.H. posted, With the small/flexable base one is able to tilt the saw slightly to keep the cut square even if the surface is slightly out of square.(ex. hewn timber) This is refered to as putting a little english on it. The base is only a depth stop. It's not the saw that has to mind rough surfaces it's the sawer. Tom

John, How many saws would we have to buy to get Makita to market them in the US again ?

I'd buy one.

We'd get one, also. We've been looking for a good saw that's smaller than the 16" Mak. 13" would be great. The 10" bigfoot was a disappointment (the difficult angle setting, which was mentioned, and also, the blade guard sticks), as was the 10" Milwaukee (hard to keep square). Would love to try the 13" Makita. We're generally impressed with their stuff. CB.

John,
Count me in as a customer for that 13" saw. Scott

Tom

I don't have a number and while a large response is good so is explaining what it is that we like about this tool and thereby give Makita some rational for bringing the saw back and marketing it to us and anyone else they can sell it to.
I just see no reason to be passive about this. They want to sell tools and we want to buy them.

I think that Whit summed up the tools virtues very nicely.

Anyone else have comments along those lines?

And yeah..more is better...vote early and vote often

I like:

5" depth of cut
weight
power
visibility of the blade
robust construction

If they were priced in between the 10" and the 16", I would buy 3.

Gabel

We sure are glad to see that someone else is interested in the Makita 13" saw. As Goldilocks said "This one is JUST right." Our joiners would give up several of their 10" saws for just one more Makita 13". We have three in the shop (one ten years old). If we had to chose one saw for the shop, this would be it! Just point us in the right direction. Bonnie and David, Goshen Timber Frames.

13" Makita, I will take two please. I would also be interested in a Chisel Mortiser and the housed router. Makita needs to to loosen up a little and sell us the good stuff. They already have two or three generations better chain mortisers than they sell us. I would also be interested in the UK saws that Colin spoke of. Mafell and Protool are expensive for stuff that brakes easily. Makita makes a good durable saw. HEY MAKITA GUY SELL US THE SAW or we will stop selling you all that premium Northwest Timber!

You can count me in for 1. I've been most disappointed with my bigfoot.

mmmmm....13" Makita.....*drools*
Count me in.

i'd like one as well.

thanks,
pete

We would also buy a few for the same reasons already posted.

I've only used a 13" once, and I found it to be smooth. Some tools have geometry and others have, well, clunkiness.

I bought a bigfoot without much thought on a recommendation and it lasted about a month before we all cussed it out and then my dad bumped the foot and broke the base.

We need robust, light tools with proven geometry. I'd buy a 13" Makita.

Zach

I'm lucky enough to have a coveted 13" Makita. I bought it through an American importer of Japanese tools that subsequently received a not so nice legal letter from Makita Japan. In general I like it. It's not as easy to handle as a Bigfoot, but it cuts a whole lot straighter. The Makita 13 can still wander a good bit (mmmm paring end grain) and I'm guessing the remedy would be a fatter blade like the Mafell. But then you need more power and so on. I believe I bought it for about the same price as the 16" Makita. I would definately support Makita Japan importing some of their tools.
B

For the record I would also be very happy if Makita would make available the saws that are sold in the UK. Those (the 10 and 14 inch) saws are awesome. I heard a rumor that they may be available in Canada in the next year or so. I will not divulge my source. (It was some guy named scooter)

gh

I tried to by one of the 14" saws Gabel spoke of online from the UK. I got as far as confirmation with a credit card, and than it shut me down and said that they needed to contact me on the phone. They never did, and the phone number they gave me is always busy. I will keep trying.

I had a similiar experience as Bill Sturm when I tried to order the European 5103R and the 5143R.

I know folks like the antiquated 13" and I have one and like it also, but it is soooo old school/medieval compared to the newer Euro saws they sale.

Are the craftspeople of North America not worthy of these saws?

Do you know what the gentleman at Timber Wolf Tools said when I asked him about it?

He said that he has spoken to the North American Makita representative (the main dude) and that guy said that North Americans do not want such quality and prefer the cheaper stuff instead.

I pared it down, but that was the jist of it.
-Collin

I heard the same story from Timberwolf when I talked to them at a conference a couple of years ago.I just dont buy that reasoning, all the other tools that Makita sells in Europe are the same ones we get here! The number of posts on this topic would lead one to believe that their are some of us who do want quality tools, and are willing to pay a little extra to get them.
Does any one know what would be involved in someone buying the tools in Europe and shipping them privately? The reason I ask is that my daughter is spending this semester in France. Tom

tom,
We've had a large power tool shipped to us from the UK. We had an acquaintance buy it and ship it to us. Usually you have to pay customs on it (I forget how much but I think it's around 15-20%). We got lucky. You would need to be prepared to pay the customs duty on it. Other than that, there's nothing really to it. If you buy from the UK, make sure you aren't paying VAT, which is 17%. Items leaving the country are exempt.

I agree with everyone that Makita should offer these tools to the North American market. The alleged reasoning for not offering them here is B.S. True, the average carpenter has no use for a 14" saw, but the ones who do expect quality.

I doubt Makita will ever re-release the older style 13" saw here as it's not double insulated. I think they should just get on the ball and sell us the European tools. Until then, I will just have to pick mine up "in country" and bring them back.

gh

Gabel, I don't think that the 16"saw, 10 1/4"saw or the chain morticer are double insulated and they are selling them here ? If it has a 110v three prong plug it's not double insulated. I have a lot of Makita tools (30+) all the double insulated ones only have two prong plugs. So that is not a good enough excuse. Tom

I agree it's not a good excuse, but the fact is you can't use any of those old Makitas and be within OSHA's regs. That's not good and they know it.

They have a better, modern, saw with all the safety bells and whistles and they won't sell it here -- for no good reason. At least if they sell it in Canada, it will be easier to get.

Isn't the new 16 double insulated? I don't have one, but I thought it is. I know it has a brake.

Gabel

Hey you Makita fanatics,

can anybody please explain what the advantage of the chisel mortiser is and if there is a pictureof one? I have googled it but without success. Only thing I found was an attachment for a drill press which can hardly be of much use for timbers.
And what was Makita thinking when they designed their version of the chain mortiser? Is there an advantage with cutting cross grain? It seems time consuming to do any adjustments on it just looking at the picture. Thanks

E.H. Carpentry I believe you will find that Holzher tools are sold in the US as Protool, but I could be wrong.

I also googled "Makita chisel mortiser" and all I found were references to the chain mortiser.

I haven't used either, but your Mafell looks like a much handier machine.

Dave

Dave,

looks like you are right about Protool. They must have changed the name in the last few years. Now they are offering their handheld tools under the Protool banner and are using the HolzHer brand for their CNC machinery.
The Protool saws and mortisers look exactly like the Holzher used to.
Having used both, HolzHer/Protool and Mafell I prefer Mafell. I did like the Holzher Beam saw though. But again the Mafell is easier to adjust. Pricing is about the same for both.

I still would like to see a chisel mortiser and know its advantages if there are any. Same for the Makita chain mortiser.

I would be interested in the 13" saw as well. As stated before the smaller saws don't do what we need and the bigger saws don't allow us to do it the way we would like.
Does anyone know where you can get replacement blades for these or similar sized saws. I have a Hitachi 13" and can not find replacement blades. I really like the saw but without blades it is just a large door stop.

Didn't I see a topic where someone was going to Japan for some reason. Maybe he would be willing to "be the hero," take our orders, buy the saws, and have them shipped back. I know there are a lot of what if's with this idea, but if someone doesn't take a little bit of initative it's not going to happen.

Yes,That would be me.
E.H. & others who are interested,e-mail me at edgewrks@gtec.com I have old Makita tool pictures and information, I can send you a copy.

Gable, my 16"saw (newer blue & silver model) is not double insulated. Tom

The original intent of this post was to encourage and provide reasons for Makita USA to bring more of their product line into the country.
That way we would have tools with warranties, parts etc.

Well John, are they paying attention? There are more posts to this topic than any other in the tool forum. Most of Makita's tools for timber framing have been unavailable in the US since 2000. In most cases there is no other alternatives. Here is an opportunity for them to practicaly corner the market. I personally don't understand why a company that manufactures tools for timber framing is unwilling to sell them to timber framers. Tom

I own and use Makita tf tools, I am impressed by the tools quality and am very concerned by the grey market status. I had a 13" saw in service and it sat unused due to a repair issue. I liked the saw but lack of support would be a crucial negative in any future purchase plans.

I hope Makita or Hitachi will bring professional tf tools to the North American market, it's a continental market that is growing.

E.H., the chisel mortiser is, in my view, perfect for Japanese style work where detailed work needs to be done inside the mortise, not very good for high speed mortising and no good for dry hardwoods.

Tom,

thanks for the pics.
I kind of was picturing the chisel mortiser the way it is shown.
Did not know that they also make a chain mortiser similar to the Mafell that cuts cross grain.

When they say european market are they talking about Britain mostly, cause I have never seen any of those tools in Germany? Just the 16" saw and some smaller ones and the 6" planer.

I have recieved this from our buddy at Makita who has looked over this forum

"Thank you for the information John. Market information such as this is key to initiating product developments, and I have forwarded details of this interest to our planning committee. I cannot say when or if the project will be approved, but if it is we may ask for your assistance in developing the final solution."

I have suggested to him that they send a rep to the West. Conference to see who we are and ask questions of the framers there.

We will see

J.E.B.

Thanks for your initiative, John.

I'd buy a 13" Makita. We have three planers and three 16" Saws -all Makita. The 10 inch Milwakees base and depth adjustments are a joke.

David

Hi John,
I do not know if you have had any response from Makita, but I would just like to say that they do not need to do product development they just need to offer the tools they already make to the USA. Specifically the 5103R and the 5143R Circular Saws.

I am kinda buming, because I am having so much difficulty even having them shipped from the UK. They are all the tool of a Mafel at half the cost.
-Collin

I'd be interested in a 13" Makita saw.

I've been reading the posts about the 13" Makita with interest, since I've been using one for about 3 months.

The main problem I have had with it is the perpendicularity of the blade to the base. I had to spend about an hour filing off humps in it(the base)while in the middle of a job it was bought for, because it wouldn't saw square even with the accurate jigs I made for it. If I had more time, I'd treat the base to the kind of flat grinding over abrasive/flat plate that you do with hand-planes.

As said by Tom earlier in this thread, you can "adjust" it by the way you saw, but it would be so much easier if it was made properly in the first place.

Otherwise it's a useful tool I wouldn't be without.

ref the Makita mortiser: I don't have any problems with this tool, after 3 years use. The chains are very easy to sharpen yourself (I do it by eye with a Dremel). However, I have just purchased a Mafell and will be interested in the comparisons.

ref the Makita beam planer: recently planed 10 tons of dry oak with it, without any problem, though the knives must be changed as soon as they start to lose a good edge.

Conclusion: thanks to Makita, but not to the guy who manages production of the baseplates (seen it in other models).

PS based in Channel Isles between UK and France

Lignator,

congratulation on your Mafell Mortiser. You will not regret the purchase, believe me.
As for the NEW!!! saw needing adjustment. You get what you pay for. There are a lot of guys here that swear on Makita mainly because it is a lot less expensive then other brands. At the same time they are complaining about weight (5-10 lbs more than a any MAfell!!!!) hard to find parts or tools not available anymoreor at least not on the US market. If not Mafell than I would opt for Hema/Protool just not Makita. Sorry guys.


Edited for smilies. I was going to have them within my post but instead the ended up in the header???????? Oh well, that needs improvement as well.

EH, after you showed me your Mafell tools, I would definately save up for them. They really are a step (or two ) above the competition. I have used the 16" Makitas, and I feel they are lacking in many ways. The base plate especially, they are too easy to knock out of adjustment, and the thin blades tend to heat up and bind too easy.


Dave

I was surprised to find this post reanimated

Unfortunately I have come to believe that this topic has other resemblances to a zombie....i.e. it's a dead issue.

At the West conference I had a conversation with David Powell of Timberwolf Tools who has been working on Makita for quite a long time about this and other timber tools. They have been invariably intransigent in their position that they have a 10" saw and a 16" saw here and they don't see the need for a tool that falls between. (and before someone posts it...yes I know the 16" has major suckage issues)
Perhaps they see this as too much of a niche market to warrant the UL testing process.
Whatever their reason I wouldn't be expecting to see any here thru official channels anytime soon
Dave also mentioned that Makita aggressively pursues anyone they believe to be bringing these tools in country
Word to the wise.....

John,

why would they pursue someone who is buying their tools elsewhere and then bring them to the US for their one use????

There are other companies with similar procedures and just another reason not to buy their products. Maybe they do not want you to be one of their customers???

Well enough said.

E.H.

Dunno
yep
Dunno
yep

Have recently received both morticer and carpenters chainsaw: cost of a secondhand car but looks worth the price.!......

I would buy a 13" if it was offered again. They aren't easy to come by on the used market these days.

why on earth would Makita not want to make money? Are they just sitting on their hands waiting for everyone in north america to get so hard up for this saw that when they do finally offer it, everybody will go out and buy three. Of course that is probably the case now. it just doesn't make any sense that they wouldn't want to sell their finest tools. it seems that their entire product line is going through some kind of up grade. Why leave this out? The rest of the world has a leg up on us. what gives?

thoroughly confused
Bloveland

It's probaly expesive to add support for a new product. New manuals, spare parts, UL Certification, etc. If the volume looks low, then they probably can;t justify it. Just my $.02

CB.

Has the cause of the 13" saw gone the way of the dodo? do we need to start a petition? organize a sit in? beg? plead? cry???
America is in dire need of a better large saw that doesn't cost you your 1st born (ehem...Mafell)
but seriously, what would it take to persuade Makita to spread the love.
Bloveland

I was looking for a 13" last summer/fall and couldn't find one. I found it easier to handle than the 16" when I tried it. I couldn't find one and I think I even sent an email to Makita. So I ended up buying a used 16" even though it's not my preferred.

I am interested in a 13 inch Makita.