"What does one of these cost a square foot?"
Brother...that one drives us all crazy!!
I usually start with a smile and it depends...Then I give them that average from before of $9.5 to $600...This usually (if they are really looking for a price and a contract) leads to better conversations...
From another conversation on the forum now, I pointed out that it is EXTREMELY!!! important not to confuse "turn key" pricing with the cost of a frame per square "anything" or board foot costs...These are "apples and oranges." I think that is where I might have confused folks a bit with my comments...I should of clarified that, as many folks (including timber framers) confuse the two.
For example, there is no such thing as a "typical sq ft price for a timber frame" but it IS possible to say " a timber framed New World Dutch barn would typically be x$'s a sq. ft."
YES!!! and perfect...That's it...generalities are to start the conversation with a potential client then we dial them in...
I agree wholeheartedly about open ended T and M work. Once in a while I'll do time and material, but with a "not to exceed" number as a cap. 95% of what I do is all solid pricing.
Yep...Unless I am doing some really nebulous consulting work I have a set price and even with "consulting" it is by the day plus per diem and travel costs.
I must say that I have learned the hard way what to charge, by under bidding projects. But if I didn't know how much to charge, then I obviously wasn't worth paying that much anyway...grin.
That is part of the reason I try to share here and be as open as possible with the information I have (and do) accumulate. It helps each of us to know better our craft and to give potential clients a consensus of market values as they rise and fall.
I have run across instances a couple times now where people have gone with me because I gave them a firm price.
Of course!! Because you are presenting the confidence of a professional and even if your price may be higher than others, your credence and knowledge begets confidence within the client of your abilities...Which is all our goals.
The other timber framer wouldn't give a firm price, said the project was so complicated that there was no way to figure it out and there was no way to figure how long it might take.
Common (too common) and a sign that this individual is not ready to be cutting frames professionally in my opinion. I don't mean for that to sound arrogant...but...there are more than half of them out there that I meet that are "selling frames" and they have little to no experience...They may have been "contractors" for a meager 15 years but have only been timber framing for half of that...I am sorry, that is not the way it use to be...You worked with a Timberwright for at least a decade before you took off on your own. Now they will do it after a single workshop...!!!???
I am fine with folks with less experience (and lots of talent) cutting and selling frames, but they need a knowledge base beyond their years and chronological experience. I know of a few "young folk" that are some of the best out there...But...in my view they are more than "channeling the old spirits" in there work and knowledge...They also are very open and humble folks, which is probably why they are so talented...
This timber framer also gives classes as well! You can't even make this stuff up!
Sean...I get this everyday and it drives me "batty!!!" I know of 4 "timber frame workshops" being taught in the next 6 months (and counting) that are anywhere from $500 to $1500 and not a single one of them is being taught by someone with more than 6 years of experience and most by those with less than 3 year!!!
It's an epidemic and is spilling into who I have to compete with for projects in both building frame and teaching...The poor consumer doesn't know better unless I take the time to "front load" them with the skill sets of "good shopping" whether it is a timber frame building or a workshop...
I wish I could stop and see you, I am passing through your area today on the way to a Dutch Barn and then on to a Wisconsin project...
Give me a call some time...(or any time you need a "what do you think..." conversation)
Cheers,
j
